diff --git a/src/SUMMARY.md b/src/SUMMARY.md
index 101fcf880..41e16c5e6 100644
--- a/src/SUMMARY.md
+++ b/src/SUMMARY.md
@@ -113,7 +113,9 @@
     - [Bound vars and Parameters](./bound-vars-and-params.md)
 - [Type inference](./type-inference.md)
 - [Trait solving](./traits/resolution.md)
-    - [Early and Late Bound Parameter Definitions](./early-late-bound.md)
+    - [Early and Late Bound Parameter Definitions](./early-late-bound-summary.md)
+        - [What are early and late bound parameters](./what-does-early-late-bound-mean.md)
+        - [Interactions with turbofishing](./turbofishing-and-early-late-bound.md)
     - [Higher-ranked trait bounds](./traits/hrtb.md)
     - [Caching subtleties](./traits/caching.md)
     - [Specialization](./traits/specialization.md)
diff --git a/src/early-late-bound-summary.md b/src/early-late-bound-summary.md
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..223e2251d
--- /dev/null
+++ b/src/early-late-bound-summary.md
@@ -0,0 +1,10 @@
+# Early/Late bound parameters
+
+This section discusses what it means for generic parameters to be early or late bound.
+
+```rust
+fn foo<'a, T>(b: &'a u32) -> &'a u32 { a }
+//     ^^  ^early bound
+//     ^^
+//     ^^late bound
+```
\ No newline at end of file
diff --git a/src/turbofishing-and-early-late-bound.md b/src/turbofishing-and-early-late-bound.md
new file mode 100644
index 000000000..a1d8a64e8
--- /dev/null
+++ b/src/turbofishing-and-early-late-bound.md
@@ -0,0 +1,120 @@
+# Turbofishing's interactions with early/late bound parameters
+
+The early/late bound parameter distinction on functions introduces some complications
+when providing generic arguments to functions. This document discusses what those are
+and how they might interact with future changes to make more things late bound.
+
+## Can't turbofish generic arguments on functions sometimes
+
+When a function has any late bound lifetime parameters (be they explicitly defined or
+implicitly introduced via lifetime elision) we disallow specifying any lifetime arguments
+on the function. Sometimes this is a hard error other times it is a future compat lint
+([`late_bound_lifetime_arguments`](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/42868)).
+
+```rust
+fn early<'a: 'a>(a: &'a ()) -> &'a () { a }
+fn late<'a>(a: &'a ()) -> &'a () { a }
+
+fn mixed<'a, 'b: 'b>(a: &'a (), b: &'b ()) -> &'a () { a }
+
+struct Foo;
+impl Foo {
+    fn late<'a>(self, a: &'a ()) -> &'a () { a }
+}
+
+fn main() {
+    // fine
+    let f = early::<'static>;
+    
+    // some variation of hard errors and future compat lints
+    Foo.late::<'static>(&());
+    let f = late::<'static>;
+    let f = mixed::<'static, 'static>;
+    let f = mixed::<'static>;
+    late::<'static>(&());
+}
+```
+
+The justification for this is that late bound parameters are not present on the
+`FnDef` so the arguments to late bound parameters can't be present in the substs
+for the type. i.e. the `late` function in the above code snippet would not have
+any generic parameters on the `FnDef` zst:
+```rust
+// example desugaring of the `late` function and its zst + builtin Fn impl
+struct LateFnDef;
+impl<'a> Fn<(&'a ())> for LateFnDef {
+    type Output = &'a ();
+    ...
+}
+```
+
+The cause for some situations giving future compat lints and others giving hard errors
+is a little arbitrary but explainable:
+- It's always a hard error for method calls
+- It's only a hard error on paths to free functions if there is no unambiguous way to
+create the substs for the fndef from the lifetime arguments. (i.e. the amount of
+lifetimes provided must be exactly equal to the amount of early bound lifetimes or
+else it's a hard error)
+
+## Back compat issues from turning early bound to late bound
+
+Because of the previously mentioned restriction on turbofishing generic arguments, it
+is a breaking change to upgrade a lifetime from early bound to late bound as it can cause
+existing turbofishies to become hard errors/future compat lints.
+
+Many t-types members have expressed interest in wanting more parameters to be late bound.
+We cannot do so if making something late bound is going to break code that many would
+expect to work (judging by the future compat lint issue many people do expect to be able
+to turbofish late bound parameters).
+
+## Interactions with late bound type/const parameters
+
+If we were to make some type/const parameters late bound we would definitely not want
+to disallow turbofishing them as it presumably(?) would break a Tonne of code. 
+
+While lifetimes do differ from type/consts in some ways I(BoxyUwU) do not believe there
+is any justification for why it would make sense to allow turbofishing late bound
+type/const parameters but not late bound lifetimes.
+
+## Removing the hard error/fcw
+
+From reasons above it seems reasonable that we may want to remove the hard error and fcw
+(removing the errors/fcw is definitely a blocker for making more things late bound).
+
+example behaviour:
+```rust
+fn late<'a>(a: &'a ()) -> &'a () { a }
+
+fn accepts_fn(_: impl for<'a> Fn(&'a ()) -> &'a ()) {}
+fn accepts_fn_2(_: impl Fn(&'static ()) -> &'static ()) {}
+
+fn main() {
+    let f = late::<'static>;
+    
+    accepts_fn(f); //~ error: `f` doesnt implement `for<'a> Fn(&'a ()) -> &'a ()`
+    accepts_fn_2(f) // works
+    
+    accepts_fn(late) // works
+}
+````
+
+one potential complication is that we would want a way to specify a generic argument
+to a function without having to specify arguments for all previous parameters. i.e.
+ideally you could write the following code somehow.
+```rust
+fn late<'a, 'b>(_: &'a (), _: &'b ()) {}
+
+fn accepts_fn(_: impl for<'a> Fn(&'a (), &'static ())) {}
+
+fn main() {
+    // a naive implementation would have a `ReInfer` as the subst for `'a` parameter
+    // no longer allowing the FnDef to satisfy the `for<'a> Fn(&'a ()` bound
+    let f = late::<'_, 'static>;
+    accepts_fn(f);
+}
+```
+Maybe we can just special case astconv for `_`/`'_` arguments for late bound parameters somehow
+and have it not mean the same thing as `_` for early bound parameters. Regardless I think we
+would need a solution that would allow writing the above code even if it was done by some new
+syntax such as havign to write `late::<k#no_argument, 'static>` (naturally `k#no_argument`
+would only make sense as an argument to late bound parameters).
diff --git a/src/early-late-bound.md b/src/what-does-early-late-bound-mean.md
similarity index 100%
rename from src/early-late-bound.md
rename to src/what-does-early-late-bound-mean.md