Does this caravan area have a .. ?

[petitminion]

If you want me to create one issue per question let me know. In the mean this is a proposition to tag objects tagged with this tag : caravan_site

General

Affected tag(s) to be modified/added: fee
Question asked: Does this caravan area have a fee?
response : yes/no

some question for theeses tags :

• sanitary_dump_station
• water_point
• power_supply

Checklist

Checklist for quest suggestions (see guidelines):

• [ x ] 🚧 To be added tag is established and has a useful purpose
• [ x ] 🤔 Any answer the user can give must have an equivalent tagging (Quest should not reappear to other users when solved by one)
• [ x ] 🐿️ Easily answerable by any pedestrian from the outside but a survey is necessary
• [ x ] 💤 Not an overwhelming percentage of quests have the same answer (No spam)
• [ x ] 🕓 Applies to a reasonable number of map data (Worth the effort)

Ideas for implementation

Element selection:

Metadata needed:

Proposed UI:
An image of the objects (water point, sanitary dump etc) and three answer :

• yes
• no
• not sure -> let a note
• specific answer (like customers for sanitary_dump_station )

[westnordost]

Would this be visible from the outside, whether it requires a fee or not? Or woudl this be visible from the "type" of caravan site? I.e. is it possible to acquire this information without trespassing and/or asking someone?

[petitminion]

yes it's quite obvious, you have to paid to be able to park so there is a barrier and a machine that allow you to paid. There is also information about the prices

[westnordost]

I see, so it looks like this is eligible. For the other tags, sounds to me that you already have to be inside the caravan site to be able to answer these, no? Caravan sites are usually not really off limits for people to just go through, but I think it would not be ok to sniff about to look for these things as long as you are not a customer.

[petitminion]

A lot of caravan area, at least in france are free because their is laws that make them mandatory in some spaces. There is an environmental need of sanitary_dump_station so they are freely accessible most of the time

[mnalis]

• related issue Quests for Amenities at Campsites #4198 and PR Camping site quests #4213 where some of the suggestions have been discussed (and after discussion some of them implemented, although in different way, e.g. backcountry=* vs. fee=* ).

It would be good if you @petitminion could read those issue/PR and give feedback which of those quests would apply here too, and which remains to be added.

As I understand it, tourism=caravan_site is similar to tourism=camp_site + caravans=yes? So it seems logical to me that perhaps code for those might be enhanced to also include this tagging, and add missing details.

There is an environmental need of sanitary_dump_station so they are freely accessible most of the time

if I understand correctly that it is almost always available, then there should be no quest for that? (see "💤 Not an overwhelming percentage of quests have the same answer (No spam)" tenet above)

[petitminion]

Camp_site and caravan_site are différent has you can see in the wiki off caravan_site. So Backcountry doesn't apply here. And I don't think this has something to do with the code of camp_site

if I understand correctly that it is almost always available, then there should be no quest for that?

Well actually I wasn't clear we saying that most of them are free. It's more that most of them can be accessed freely by foot, there is no physical delimitation since these are parkings. So it's not an issue to get in there by foot.

Do you know any tools to have statistics about tags ?

[mnalis]

Do you know any tools to have statistics about tags ?

You mean, more detailed than taginfo.openstreetmap.org linked on those wiki pages? One probably could use overpass-turbo.eu if needed, but you'd need to know _exactly_ what you want statistics about?

[rhhsm]

At first I was as confused as @mnalis : what makes a caravan site so different from a camping site that a different quest is needed. But then I understood that this is not about caravans (trailers) but about motorhomes/campers/campervans. Maybe this confusion should be cleared first (at the wiki) before quests for such sites could be developed?

[petitminion]

if I understand correctly that it is almost always available, then there should be no quest for that? (see "💤 Not an overwhelming percentage of quests have the same answer (No spam)" tenet above)

I looked into the statistics and I think the quest for fees should be done, plz see https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/tourism=caravan_site#combinations.

Maybe this confusion should be cleared first (at the wiki) before quests for such sites could be developed?

I don't see how to make this more clear but feel free to do it :

They may also have some space for tents. If a site is primarily for tents, it should be tagged as [tourism](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:tourism)=[camp_site](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:tourism%3Dcamp_site). If [tents](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:tents) are allowed on a site it should be tagged with tents=[yes](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:tents%3Dyes&action=edit&redlink=1).```

[qugebert]

I can try to implement the fee-quest, but is this really a simple yes/no-quest or might there be conditional fees like in the parking_fee quest?
€: @westnordost is it okay to just add tourism=caravan_site to the parking_fee quest, as there is not so much difference to normal parcing sites?

[petitminion]

@qugebert thx you :) Afaik there is only yes/no possibility

[westnordost]

Actually, I think the AddGeneralFee quest could just be extended.

[qugebert]

Actually, I think the AddGeneralFee quest could just be extended.

Yes, i didn't know this quest but this makes sense.

[petitminion]

Should we speak here about the three other ones ?

• sanitary_dump_station
• water_point
• power_supply

[rhhsm]

I think that before these quests are implemented in SC, the terminology involved should be clarified on the wiki. For instance, the tag is badly named as a caravan is generally thought of as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caravan_(trailer) while these quests are about sites for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorhome Maybe the tag should be renamed motorhome_site? @petitminion will you bring it up on https://community.openstreetmap.org/c/general/tagging/70 or shall I do it?

[petitminion]

The wiki definition clearly state motorhomes and the terminology doesn't bother me. Also it will means a lot of work to change in osm side I suppose. So I don't feel like asking to change it.
Also mr is merged and this issue will document it. But if you want to ask for a terminology change feel free to do it.