Create Shaarli Organization

[alexdantas]

How about we create a shaarli organization?

This way we can join members, create teams and push changes way faster.
People could write wikis, documentation and stuff even better.

I'm a long-time user of Shaarli and eager to contribute!

[e2jk]

I'm seconding this proposition.
As the Debian package maintainer, I'd be pleased to see a new official release. @sebsauvage 's wiki points to the Git head, which is not what we usually like to package in Debian ;)

[nodiscc]

I've created https://github.com/shaarli/Shaarli and added some contributors (previous commiters to Shaarli) Feel free to add pull requests and merge them (once they have been tested by several contributors), edit the wiki and fix issues from this repo.

[Sbgodin]

NIce work. But with what sort of guidelines? I already made some small modifications, only one (remember me checkbox) got into the original Shaarli. But the other, making title clickable, may not be of interest. Plus, if you take all the pull requests waiting, most of them won't merge one after the other.

There's a need of choice, that's why I've been waiting for @sebsauvage to make a decision.

[nodiscc]

We could merge small, simple pull requests first. Ones that merge without conflicts.
For new features, usefulness vs amount of new code/security/complexity can be discussed in pull requests comments.

For large changes or complex merges (#158 for example), better try to rework the changes to merge easily (if it's worth it, again, discussion).

We would have an up-to-date Shaarli with most requested features/enhacements/bug fixes. @sebsauvage can pull/cherry-pick commits from there when he's back, can save a lot of work.

[Jucgshu]

I have to agree with @nodiscc.

I don't like forks. But comes a time when you have to make choices.

I like Shaarli and I wish to see the project live again :-)

[e2jk]

I agree with the thread and welcome the creation of the Shaarli organization.

One of the original goal/precepts of Shaarli is to follow the KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid) principle. I would like to see that respected, i.e. keep Shaarli as a single-user (well, we could discuss this topic...), bookmark listing project. Lightweight features such as thumbnails for links to images/videos are nice, but let's not go into things like adding comments/discussions (#185) that would make it yet-another blogging platform.

I'd really like @sebsauvage to comment on this development (I'm sending him an email right now), it would be nice if this wasn't a full fork, but rather putting Shaarli under the control of its community so that we can accelerate development, merging some of the long-standing pull requests, and release new versions more often (the last official release is 1.5 years old). That will allow me to officially update the Debian package ;)

[e2jk]

I have just sent @sebsauvage the following email:

Subject: ACTION REQUESTED: ton opinion sur la création de l'organisation Shaarli sur Github

Salut Seb,

Nous aimerions avoir ton opinion sur la récente création sur Github de l'organisation Shaarli [0].
Nous savons qu'en tant que mainteneur/développeur principal d'un projet, il est parfois difficile d'y consacrer suffisamment de temps.

Le but de l'organisation est de pouvoir adresser plus rapidement un nombre de pull request/issues, en donnant droits d’écriture au repo à un groupe légèrement plus large de développeurs.

Je copie ce message dans le ticket #191 [1] "Create Shaarli Organization", et j’espère que nous aurons le plaisir d'y voir ta réponse prochainement.

A bientôt!
+Emilien
[0] https://github.com/shaarli/Shaarli
[1] #191

[e2jk]

I've received the following response from @sebsauvage . I will let him post his own answer when he's back from holiday, but I'm glad to hear he seems to see this initiative in a positive light:

Bonjour Émilien.

Désolé pour cette réponse tardive, mais je ne suis pas encore rentré de mes vacances en <redacted>.

Je suis parfaitement conscient de la stagnation de Shaarli, et j'abonde dans le sens de l'ouverture à d'autres développeurs.

Je ferai de mon mieux pour répondre dans les jours qui viennent. (mon smartphone n'est pas l'idéal pour consulter les discussions et y répondre).

[alexdantas]

So, since we have the organization, can we consider this issue closed?

On another note, I think it would be better if @sebsauvage simply transferred this repo to the organization, instead of making it a fork.
But now I see that there are some commits there ahead of this version so it's a moot point now.

Anyway, it would be nice to erase everything here and leave a README pointing to the organizations Shaarli.

[nodiscc]

@alexdantas the changes from the organization will probably be merged here when @sebsauvage is ok with them. The official Shaarli repository is still https://github.com/sebsauvage/Shaarli/

I think it's ok to close this issue.

[marienfressinaud]

On another note, I think it would be better if @sebsauvage simply transferred this repo to the organization, instead of making it a fork.

Sure! Especially to keep trace of opened issues and pull requests!

[alexdantas]

@nodiscc If this is the official repo with changes on the organization needing to be merged here, then it's no different than @sebsauvage adding people to have write access to this repository; rendering the organization not very useful.

Even worse - if in time it creates a big discrepancy between the two repositories, it might end up being a fork of Shaarli. This would be very confusing, since it will have the name Shaarli on the organization.

The whole point of the organization is to broaden the development process.
When I created this issue (June, a couple of months ago) Shaarli seemed stalled. This repo had 21 pull requests on hold and no updates since December of the last year.

With an organization @sebsauvage can, for example, assign moderators he can trust (long-term committers) to accept pull requests, respond immediately to security concerns and so on.
This way we can remove some of the weight of his shoulders and make Shaarli, as @e2jk nicely puts, be under the control of its community so that we can accelerate it's development.

The way it is today, everything must go through him and I understand it can be hard to keep; specially for a big, long-term and much used project such as Shaarli.
Of course he is the owner and he should make the final call.

Also, I agree completely with @nodiscc on adding new features, fixing bugs, accepting pull requests. There are already good changes being made and I'm anxious to help!
I'm just laying down what I had in mind when I made this issue.

[e2jk]

@sebsauvage have you been able to give some thoughts to this topic?

[virtualtam]

Any news on the matter?
Where's the best place for new contributors to submit and discuss changes?

[e2jk]

I am regularly pinging @sebsauvage. The most recent answer I got is from October 9:

Je suis désolé, je manque à mes devoirs. :-|
oui je reçois les messages, mais je n'ai toujours pas pris le temps de répondre à cela. Honte à moi.

[nodiscc]

hey @alexdantas the (hopefully temporary) "fork" is up and running at https://github.com/shaarli/Shaarli/ ! Feel free to come and say hi or propose changes if you like.

What about we close this issue?

[e2jk]

What about we close this issue?

No, let's wait for an official statement from @sebsauvage

[marienfressinaud]

Has someone asked him directly by email to transfer ownership to Shaarli organization? @e2jk could you ping him again?

Moreover, @Sbgodin I think you're the ownership of organization, isn't it? It could be great to add @sebsauvage has an owner too ;)

I think transfer of official repository would cost at most 10 minutes of time but for great and long-term improvements.

[nodiscc]

It could be great to add @sebsauvage has an owner too

He is an owner of the organization since it's creation (https://github.com/orgs/shaarli/people) but there are public/private flags on this page, only Sbgodin has set it to public at the moment. All previous committers to sebsauvage/Shaarli were added as owners at the time of the fork (7 github accounts).

[marienfressinaud]

👍

[nodiscc]

Btw, I only suggested to close the bug because title = "Create Shaarli Organization" and https://github.com/sebsauvage/Shaarli/network is looking good for the shaarli org so I'd say, done. Side effect, the package in Debian can be up-to-date with the latest fixes.

Whether we merge back or not or move bug trackers is another question. https://github.com/shaarli/Shaarli/issues and https://github.com/shaarli/Shaarli/pulls has lots of good avenues for work before a merge is really useful. @sebsauvage is free to decide when the time is good (it's his repo) and we don't need/want ownership of his repo (the only sad thing is the bug tracker which could use a cleanup).

Just use shaarli/Shaarli if you need fixes/ active bug tracker/wiki/pull requests for now. A mention in sebsauvage's README would be great though.

Should we rename the shaarli org to something else? shaarli-community?

[e2jk]

This is the most recent statement I got from @sebsauvage on December 15, reproduced here with his authorization. In case you don't speak French and are too lazy to pass this through Google Translate ;) the short version is he hasn't abandoned Shaarli, but can't spend time on it for now.

Cette fin d'année est très lourdement chargée pour moi, aussi bien du côté professionnel que personnel. Je n'ai pas eu l'énergie de reprendre tout cela en main, et je m'en excuse. Je vous ai failli, trahis.

Je te remercie encore de ton infinie patience avec moi. Je ne devrais pas laisser Shaarli à l'abandon alors que tant de personnes attendent des actions de ma part, mais là, d'un point de vue personnel, je n'ai pas assez d'énergie pour faire avancer cela pour le moment.

Je présente mes plus plates excuses à toute la communauté. Je n'aurais jamais imaginé l'ampleur que prendrait Shaarli, et j'ai été un peu dépassé (aussi bien par l'engouement pour Shaarli que par ce qui se passe dans ma vie personnelle).

Je n'abandonne pas Shaarli. Pas du tout. Mais je ne peux pas m'y remettre dans l'immédiat.

We will continue with our temporary community fork for now, and hope to get @sebsauvage back by the spring of 2015.

[nodiscc]

I have asked @sebsauvage by mail about giving myself temporary write permissions on his repo to:

• add a mention in the README that his repo is currently unmaintained, and to advise users to use shaarli/Shaarli for requests/bug/latest updates
• clean up the bug tracker (close old, unreproducible, unanswered bugs; close unmergeable PRs and forward contributors and users to shaarli/Shaarli)

[jeekajoo]

meanwhile @sebsauvage keeps ignoring our demands of adding a mention in the README of his repo to advise users to use shaarli/Shaarli for requests/bug/latest updates...

[sebsauvage]

Added in my readme. My bad.

[jeekajoo]

Thanks