Sunroom (Greenhouse/Multi-purpose Dining/Creative/Workshop Room) ?

[nelsonic]

We are fortunate to have a decent amount of back garden space: 6m x 25m = 150m²:

Note: this image does not do it "justice", at present it is still very much a "building site"!

Our plan has always been to have a Greenhouse where we can grow seedlings of edible plants.

The question we recently asked ourselves is: can we make the Greenhouse a multi-purpose space?

https://www.google.com/search?q=greenhouse+dining+room&tbm=isch

.this, but with desks on wheels and a few sofas:
https://www.humphreymunson.co.uk/botanist-greenhouse-summer-rosewood-london/

Goal

Our goal is to make a room which has:

• Plenty of natural light ☀️ (both for the plants and people using the room)
• A wide variety of plants 🌻 (both edible and "companion" / decorative; clearly labeled of course!)
• Shelves where we can grow seedlings 🌱
• An expandable table where people can work, have a meeting or workshop. 💻
• Lockable to avoid theft of plants or other greenhouse equipment. 🔐
• Ventilated to ensure it does not over-heat.
  • We will be automating the ventilation at some point in the future. 🤖

Relevant reading:

• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allotment_(gardening)

Todo

• Draw the greenhouse model in Sketchup to share with our construction foreman
• Send 3D model to foreman to request advice and/or quote
• Request more quotes for:
  • Concrete
  • Steel structure
  • Glass: Structural Laminated Glass #228
• Get the work done!

[nelsonic]

@carolrmc this "What Type of Greenhouse Should You Build?" video is quite insightful:

https://youtu.be/FPjko9DDhcU

[Cleop]

@nelsonic - have you thought how you can ensure the greenhouse is still enjoyable in the winter/ colder temperatures? Will it be heated at all?

[nelsonic]

@Cleop good question!
We were not planning on connecting the greenhouse to the central heating.
But we were considering having fan heaters in the room which people can direct for localised heat.

Worth noting that the temperature in Braga has (historically) not gone below 5^o (Centigrade):
https://www.worldweatheronline.com/braga-weather-averages/braga/pt.aspx

it never freezes and the average temp on the coldest day is 9^o.
it won't be as cold as the "QuietSpace" warehouse was in the winter ...

My reasoning for using "space heaters" instead of plugging into the central heating is this:

• people will only use the room for certain times of the day e.g: 08:00 - 18:00. ☀️
  • we aren't expecting people to use the space at night ... 🌃
• localised heating is more energy efficient than trying to heat the whole room.
• we can use our solar energy (from roof panels) to power the local heaters on-demand.

[nelsonic]

Apparently, American's call this type of room a "Sunroom" or "Solarium" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunroom

See: https://www.google.com/search?q=sunroom&tbm=isch

[Cleop]

or us brits a conservatory or if you're mega posh 🎩 🍊 an orangery 😉

[nelsonic]

Dimensions of the Area

These are the dimensions we have to work with:

Our preliminary idea is to make the sunroom 8m x 4m between the kiwi vine and the East Wall.
And BBQ (Grill + Outdoor Oven) along the East Wall where it would not block any Sunlight.

[nelsonic]

8m x 4m might either seem big or small depending on your viewpoint ...
it's big by "single family" conservatory/room standards.
but tiny by comparison to a public greenhouse.

We feel the space will be "just right" for the number of people we are expecting to accommodate.
Baring in mind that not everyone staying in the house will be in the Sunroom at all times.
(there are 6 areas for people to work and "hang out" in; the Sunroom is the second biggest...)

If we were to hold a "lecture" style meetup in the Sunroom it would fit around 30 people:
https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/number-persons-buildings-d_118.html

[iteles]

The older gentleman who has been painting the doorframes in the house has asked if he can have the old windows, which we had originally discussed recycling into a greenhouse.

It seems that he's going to upcycle them into something else too.

I love the idea of making something out of them, but then they're quite small for the effect we want to create for the greenhouse here but they'd make great whiteboards, mini greenhouses, side tables or things of this sort!

Given that they would be upcycled anyway, it's not too much of an issue, but if we can integrate one or two into the house, that would be grand.

I propose we check out their state to see how they're faring and then make a call.

[nelsonic]

@iteles I would be delighted if the olde doors + windows go to someone who will re-use them rather than a processing plant where they would be put through a wood-chipper!

Being free to design with "fresh" materials will allow us to make something considerably slicker.
It will probably end up costing a similar amount because recycling odd-sized materials is a time-suck of measuring, re-measuring and a ton of "finishing" work.

[nelsonic]

Bumped this up to P1 to indicate the priority I feel it deserves right now in my task list.
It's not costing us money to not have the greenhouse but as soon as we do have it,
the garden will be in a much nicer state (so we can receive guests) and
we can use it to work outside and be more effective.

[nelsonic]

Just got the following error:

cannot import name
'_ArchStructureGroupCommand' from 'ArchStructure' (/Applications/FreeCAD.app/Contents/Resources/Mod/Arch/ArchStructure.py)

Posted forum question to: https://forum.freecad.org/viewtopic.php?t=78725

[nelsonic]

Decided to enter the Matrix and download the weekly build of FreeCAD in the hopes that this Arch Workbench issue is resolved: https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD-Bundle/releases/tag/weekly-builds

Appears to be working:

Getting back to adding beams. 🚧

[nelsonic]

Sadly, still getting the same error when attempting to load the Arch workbench after restarting FreeCAD ...

Updated forum: https://forum.freecad.org/viewtopic.php?p=685216#p685216

[nelsonic]

OK progress ...

[nelsonic]

Busy adding the rebar for the walls ... (manually ... ⏳ )

[nelsonic]

Getting pretty close ... 🚧

But still have a lot to layout. 🙄
This "Waterfall" approach to building stuff feels like it takes forever!! ⏳

[nelsonic]

Yesterday I added the roof beams and polycarbonate roof panels #247 to the model:

[nelsonic]

What do you think when you see a picture like this:

Via: https://www.gardenclublondon.co.uk/case-study/clapham-garden-designer/

I'll tell you what I think ... Awesome! 😍 and we can do so much better!! 👨‍💻

[carolrmc]

I think of a roof top garden that had to be accessed through a trapdoor 😍 in south London

…

On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 at 14:02, Nelson ***@***.***> wrote: What do you think when you see a picture like this: [image: CLAPHAM - Garden Club London] <https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/194400/245799024-6bbf9d95-3a5a-4788-8349-c22187b3909a.jpeg> Via: https://www.gardenclublondon.co.uk/case-study/clapham-garden-designer/ [image: image] <https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/194400/245799298-684baaf1-0372-413e-8687-4b5fe5207d12.png> I'll tell you what *I* think ... Awesome! 😍 and we can do *so much better*!! 👨‍💻 — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <#14 (comment)>, or unsubscribe <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AF37S7UBEO7U3QFEIYPM5ETXLGY7DANCNFSM4FW2B4OQ> . You are receiving this because you were mentioned.Message ID: ***@***.***>

[nelsonic]

@carolrmc lol. Yeah that was a fun project on a shoestring. No regrets. Wish I had photos. 😢
But back to the topic of this issue: the Sunroom. ☀️
It's difficult for me to explain what is in my head ... these kinds of "mood" pictures are the best I can do. 💭

[nelsonic]

Today I finally managed to get FreeCAD to cooperate (after many crashes/errors!!)
And defined the "Entrance" to the lower level which includes 14 steps, 7 planters and a slide dwyl/workshop#137:

It's definitely far from "perfect" so it would be really good to get your feedback @iteles 🙏

[nelsonic]

With the building for context:

@iteles if you have 5 minutes it might be faster for you to review the model at my desk 🖥️
and then give feedback as a comment. 💬

[iteles]

Yes, I'd love to review this with you at your desk for a more contextualised view

[iteles]

5 mins turned into an hour but it was really useful for you to talk me through the drawing layer by layer, what an unbelievable amount of work that has gone into this already!

As you said the stairs would be covered to prevent them from becoming a river in heavy rain, they're looking great. Sorry I don't have better feedback for you but it's looking good for now 💪🏻👌🏻

[nelsonic]

Added the house (the big block behind the sunroom) for context:

Not going to waste time making the existing buildings/walls high fidelity.
This is just as a reference.

[nelsonic]

Also extended the roof to cover the stairs and slide so that rain doesn't go down the slide or stairs:

[nelsonic]

Added the Tree Planters to the lower level: 🌱

There will be 10 trees planted and they will be trained to stick closely to the wall using Espalier technique:

This is one of the features I'm most looking forward to. 😍
It will take 10 - 20 years for the full effect. ⏳ But it will be worth the wait. 👴
The goal is to completely hide concrete walls with plants.

There are many trees in the list we can choose from: dwyl/phase-three#6
But need to understand if we need multiple trees of each type to pollinate and thus have fruit. 🔍 #HelpWanted 🙏

I spent T25m searching for ready-made models of Trees that I could drop into the FreeCAD model. 🌳
But no luck. This isn't SketchUp ... 🙄

Next: I'm going to work on the rebar for the base slab. 👨‍💻

[nelsonic]

Provisional List of 10 Trees I would like to plant in the lower level:

1. Apple
2. Banana, see: Plant: Banana: dwarf cavendish sunroom#3
3. Clementine
4. Fig
5. Guava

Note: Grapes, Kiwis and Passion Fruit vines will be planted in the main garden to cover the upper structure.

6. Lemon
7. Mango
8. Nectarine
9. Orange
10. Persimmon

Your input/feedback is very much wanted. 💬 🙏

[nelsonic]

Half-way through the base level slab rebar and I've already "spent" €300 in materials and at least as much again in time

Will continue with the rebar placement tomorrow morning ... 🧑‍💻 ⏳
Should be able to send the model to the Structural Engineers once the base slab is complete. 🤞

[nelsonic]

Really want to get this done so stayed up a bit longer 🙄 to finish it:

[nelsonic]

With base concrete slab covering all the rebar:

It's like it never happened ... 🙃